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For Some Countries the Dictatorship Orderly is Better Than That of Democracy Dis
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For Some Countries the Dictatorship Orderly is Better Than That of Democracy Disorderly
Tragic Photos Tells Us that the world is being destroyed by those mindless with the name of democracy.
Yekaterina Len, 61, cries outside her destroyed house following what locals say was overnight shelling by Ukrainian forces in the outskirts of the eastern Ukrainian town of Slaviansk, Ukraine. Photo: Reuters
http://www.smh.com.au/photogallery/world/best-of-the-world--may-22-2014-20140521-38p50.html
Ukrainian soldiers stay near of a checkpoint seized by them not far of Slaviansk, Ukraine, 02 May 2014. EPA/ROMAN PILIPEY
Thailand coup: King Bhumibol appoints army chief as junta head
BANGKOK: Thailand's king has formally appointed the army chief as head of the nation's new military junta following a recent coup.
“To restore peace and order in the country and for sake of unity, the king appointed General Prayut Chan-O-Cha as head of the National Council of Peace and Order to run the country," according to a royal command seen by AFP on Monday.
Prayut, who seized power four days earlier and has assumed extensive powers over the South-East Asian nation of 67 million was formally be appointed in a ceremony in Bangkok.
The monarchy headed by the revered but ailing king, 86-year-old Bhumibol Adulyadej, commands great respect among many Thais.
His blessing has traditionally been a key step in legitimising the recurring military takeovers that have taken place in Thailand, which has now seen 19 actual or attempted coups since 1932.Army spokesman Sirichan Ngathong indicated the king, who is yet to make a public statement on the coup, would not be present for the ceremony.
The military cabal led by Prayut dismissed the civilian government on Thursday, following seven months of mass anti-government protesters and related political violence.
More than 1,000 anti-coup demonstrators marched through Bangkok on Sunday with dozens of demonstrators facing off against lines of armed soldiers, as the junta warned of a crackdown if the protests continued.
The junta on Saturday announced that it had placed all law-making authority in Prayut's hands. - AFPhttp://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/22/military-coup-thailand-peace-general-prayuth-chan-ocha
Thailand's army seized control of the country and suspended the constitution on Thursday after rival factions failed in talks to end six months of political turmoil, causing the nation's 19th coup in 82 years.
General Prayuth Chan-ocha, head of the army and now acting prime minister, did not use the word "coup" in his televised announcement to the nation but declared the takeover was necessary "in order for the country to return to normality quickly, and for society to love and be at peace again".
He added: "We ask the public not to panic and to carry on their lives normally."
On Friday the general summoned members of the politically pivotal Shinawatra family to a meeting. Yingluck Shinawatra was forced from office as caretaker prime minister earlier in the month by a court ruling; her brother, Thaksin, was ousted as prime minister by the military in 2006 and opponents argue the family exercises a corrupt grip on Thai politics that must be broken.
The Reuters news agency said Yingluck Shinawatra and the general were seen arriving on Friday at an army facility, while the army announced it had banned 155 people including politicians and activists from leaving the country "in order to maintain peace and resolve the conflict".
The surprise announcement of a full military takeover followed the unexpected late-night invocation of martial law on Tuesday, which the army said was not a coup but merely a peacekeeping move to "restore order" in a nation beleaguered by political in-fighting.
The US secretary of state, John Kerry, in a strongly worded statement warning that the takeover would "have negative implications for the US-Thai relationship", openly condemned Prayuth's move and said: "There is no justification for this military coup."
He added: "I urge the restoration of civilian government immediately, a return to democracy, and respect for human rights and fundamental freedoms, such as press freedoms. The path forward for Thailand must include early elections that reflect the will of the people."
Bangkok's road traffic increased Thursday evening after the military announced a nationwide 10pm-5am curfew. Many people stocked up on essentials at supermarkets and small shops.
The army also banned public gatherings of five or more people, suspended all television and radio stations (which are permitted to play on
Rival political factions have spent the past two days at Bangkok's Army Club, where they attempted to come to a compromise over the future of the country.
The coup became apparent during Thursday's negotiations when Prayuth asked the caretaker justice minister, Chaikasem Nitisiri, whether the government was ready to resign.
"As of this minute, the government will not resign," Chaikasem allegedly answered, according to the English-language Nation newspaper.
"So, as of this minute, I decide to seize ruling power," Prayuth retorted.
An electoral commissioner who was at the negotiations said that Prayuth had told the assembled company: "Everyone must sit still."
Rumours of a possible coup had been circulating since November, when anti-government protesters first took to the streets to demand the resignation of the incumbent Pheu Thai party. But Prayuth's seemingly sudden decision on Thursday – in the midst of negotiations between rival political groups – took many by surprise.
"The army clearly had no sincerity in brokering talks," said Michael Connors, a south-east Asia expert and associate professor at the Malaysia campus of the University of Notthingham. "In retrospect [the coup] must have been calculated, and it looks like the [declaration of] martial law was just a pretext to deliver a strategic advantage to the coup group."
Despite options reportedly being floated at the Prayuth-mediated talks at the Army Club no agreement was reached, although the rival leaders did tweet "selfie" pictures of themselves smiling and laughing together at the round-table discussions.
All that changed, however, when hundreds of extra troops arrived at the venue and took away the leader of the anti-government protests, Suthep Thaugsuban.
Various other leaders have also been detained, including members of the opposition party, of the Pheu Thai government, plus members of the pro-government Red Shirts and anti-government People's Democratic Reform Committee (PDRC).
Thailand's caretaker prime minister, Niwutthamrong Boonsongpaisan, who assumed the role this month after Yingluck Shinawatra was removed from office by a controversial court ruling, was not at the meeting on Thursday and his location was unknown. Rumours that he could have been at the US embassy were denied publicly, and the army asked him to turn himself in.
Prayuth had warned he wanted an end to the political warring that, since November, as anti-government protesters begancalling for a new, appointed, government, has led to the deaths of 28 people and caused injury to more than 700 others.
"This must be resolved swiftly before I retire, otherwise I won't retire," said Prayuth, who is due to step down at the end of September. "I will not allow Thailand to be like Ukraine or Egypt."
The new Peace and Order Maintaining Command, which includes the army, navy and police, will now be in charge of governingthe country. The stated aim is to reform Thailand's economic, political and social structures, Prayuth said, though courts and parliament's upper house will continue as normal.
Chiranuch Premchaiporn, press freedom advocate of the on
The takeover was met with a warning by the Red Shirt activists' group, the United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD), which vowed retaliationshortly after the televised statement.
"NOW it is COUP – stand by for a retaliation from the UDD," the group tweeted.
Various governments, including those of France and Germany, as well as human rights groups, have condemned the military's move – the 19th coup since absolute monarchy was abolished here in 1932.
"The military's seizure of power has become routine and a sad reality of Thai politics," said Karim Lahidji, of the International Federation for Human Rights. "Two days after it publicly declared that it was not going to stage a coup, the military seized power and plunged Thailand into a deeper political crisis."
The junta warned it would block any social media platforms in the country found to carry content that incited violence or criticised military leaders. In a television bulletin the military urged "co-operation from social media operators and all involved to stop such messages that incite violence, break the law or criticise the coup council".
"If we find any to be in violation we will suspend the service immediately and will summon those responsible for prosecution."
Observers say Thailand's next move will depend on just how well the various factions, and the public, respond to the military takeover.
"This coup looks like many others going back to the 1970s: the language used, the seeming solidarity among the main branches of the security forces," said Michael Montesano, co-coordinator of the Thailand studies programme at Singapore's institute of south-east Asian studies. "They've inherited a mess and how they're going to manage it depends on how much resistance there is to the government that they attempt to install."
Connors said, though, that the fact that there had been so much talk of resistance proved this coup was different from all the others. "They've never had a coup like this, in which this potential of mass resistance is so strong," he said. "It's on
23 May 2014 5:25am
Jacob, we're not rejoicing here on Din Daeng, and by the look of my Facebook feed pretty much nobody else is (Thai or foreign), since the ousting of an elected government by the armed forces is seen by most sensible adults as a bad thing, even those who don't approve of said government.
For the sake of comparison I'm sure many British people loathe the very sight of David Cameron, but only an idiot would rejoice if this evening he and his cabinet were arrested and replaced by lots of men with tanks, whose first order of business was to make it illegal to go for a walk. You may allow yourself a brief moment of schadenfreude, but once your satisfied smirk had passed you'd settle down to the serious business of condemning the situation.
Sadly it seems Jacob is one of those expats who have fallen into the trap of choosing sides in this mess, proudly proclaiming their support for red or yellow from their lofty perch on the bar stool. The fact is that both sides are wrong. Both are packed full of corrupt, scheming assholes who long ago shook off the burden of common sense. Both sides are absolutely certain that they're fighting the good fight, but the only certainty in this sad situation is that the Thai people will lose whatever the outcome.
supermicrodot fleeing 23 May 2014 8:25am
I have friends and relatives in Bangkok and some have been very active in the Yellow Shirt movement. I totally agree with you. Thaksin Shiniwatra is almost a Thai Berlusconi and after he was ousted for corruption, he was still ruling the country through his sister. He got the support of the rural population through subsidies and grandstand political projects and created his own private army of thugs. They bussed in supporters from all over the country to be anti Yellow shirt demonstrators The police were controlled by the Shiniwatra clan and that is why the red shirt gangs got a way with so much violence against the protestors. In the last few years of turmoil, you must admit, the Thai people have exercised remarkable non violent restraint. I got an email from my nephew this morning and he is in Bangkok and life goes on relatively normal.
mrtncooke 22 May 2014 9:13pm
Not sure how much those commenting actually know. The upcoming election would not have solved the problem as the main opposition party was unlikely to stand in it. Their position, and that of those demonstrating for the last 7 months is that further elections are pointless until corruption is eliminated, it is widely accepted that votes are bought in the North & NE regions.
They must make sure that this period once and for all settles these issues and future elections can be fair and binding.
kenrigg mrtncooke
22 May 2014 10:38pm
"They must make sure that this period once and for all settles these issues and future elections can be fair and binding."
So, if a political group is unhappy at the way an elected Government runs a country, and refuses to participate in the democratic process, the democratic process is pointless ?
So, the corruption of pre-Shinawat Governments that so benefited that elite political group is irrelevant and only that of the current elected government is relevant.
So, using the public exchequer to fund policies that benefit the poor and so bring votes is "vote buying".
So, what policies have been put forward by Suthep that will ensure democracy is entrenched and coruption eliminated ?
Mr. Holbroke below has got it right and until Suthep actually puts forward a manifesto of the changes he seeks, it remains plain he is a self-seeking autocrat.
ID1833104 fastbowler 24 May 2014 8:48am
all true I believe...and did Thaksin ad his successors not so the same? Incidentally is not the elected government the ruling class when in power? Maybe when you have a government that does not have it's prime ministers relative in exile saying give me and my family amnesty from previous alleged crimes and charges and I will tell my supporters to go home rather than coming home to fight them if you are innocent, then maybe democracy might have some meaning here. Same old merry go round here I am afraid. You cannot have a working democracy with politically self-interested groupings only looking out for their own self interests. Political democratic maturity is sadly a long way away here. I am no supporter of this coup by an means but as a long term resident it is of no surprise either. The current political intransigence on all sides, and the last administrations economic strategy has created havoc for the average Thai on the street who just wants to get on with everyday life. Democratic elections, (and you can debate the fairness or not of these until the cows come home) do not give the ruling party of whatever hue the right to rule in it's own interests rather than that of the nation. See you at the next coup in about 4.31 years (the average since 1932)!
ID0880986 22 May 2014 10:26pm
I'd say it has all gone rather well so far.
No grenades. No riots and the only thing hurt are the egos of the politicians who have failed this country and its people. Banning ALL of them and their families from ever being in politics again may be a good place to start?
DjangoReinhart ID0880986 22 May 2014 10:32pm
As spoken by a true fascist - I guess imprisoning all the politicians is a good idea as well?
And by the way why did the Politicians "fail"? Because a fascist mob of thugs had been allowed by the police and military to besiege government offices for the past 6 months.
The Yingluck administration was working fine before that. You may disagree with some of their politics, but they had not shown themselves incapable of governing. Anyone saying that is just totally in thrall to the anti-Thaksin propaganda machine.
ID0880986 DjangoReinhart 22 May 2014 11:41pm
On the contrary I am not on either side, i think they are all barmy. We have a government being run via Skype by a fugitive from justice and the corruption from the rice pledging scheme alone is estimated at $8 billion - the state coffers are being raped. They were trying to change the constitution to forgive the brother of the Prime Minister and she appointed her brother in law as head of the Police - and this was all backed by the reds who are basically an armed insurgency sponsored by Thaksin.
On the other side we had another bunch of armed thugs disrupting the country and its functioning, spouting more hate and sedition and splitting the society.
As the two sides went further apart most people went to the middle and i am convinced that the majority of Thais want this to finish. In the end, neither of the sides threatening armed combat in the streets could muster more than a few thousand so someone had to stop this madness.
I am a Westerner and things here have no relation whatsoever to what we know as politics so I try and judge how we would deal with all of this in our respective countries. Would we accept any of the above?
ID0880986 DjangoReinhart 22 May 2014 11:52pm
PS And when i said banning ALL politicians and their families i meant BOTH sides.
Your comments were just the usual knee jerk reaction from someone wrapped up in the crap that is being dumped on the Thai people by the people they voted for (and again, BOTH sides).
Janey0 22 May 2014 10:38pm
Our country would never imagine we would have seen this kind of behaviour but this is where we will end up if we give in to our government. They have changed the rules on honesty and decency and have used the military in our country (for the first time) for their own political ends. They are now going to reduce our federalism and put the states against each other. Our people will get very very angry. It is a very scary future.
Arthurlovesjazz Arthurlovesjazz 22 May 2014 11:03pm
Follow the link.
Politicians and others told to to the military, including Yingluck Shinawatra and her family, the caretaker PM, Niwattumrong Boonsongpaisan and members of the former government.
ISP's ordered to to "keep track, monitor, stop the dissemination of online info"...
The constitution has been suspended.
The army is reported on the streets in Udon (NE) and Chiang Mai (N), UDD strongholds.
Former General Prawit Wongsuwan and former army chief General Anupong Paochinda - and ex commanders of the powerful Queen's Guard - were behind, first, the PDRC and Sutep Thaugsuban and now the coup.
This is a well planned and executed coup by the monarchist, military elite. It is not a spontaneous reaction to political discord.
itsabigworldoutthere Arthurlovesjazz 23 May 2014 2:32am
Of course it is a planned military coup, however they try to disguise it! All right thinking countries must immediately apply sanctions... Thai economy is heavily dependent on tourism... Unfortunately the people have to feel enough outrage at the monarchy and army, for there to be a public backlash against them... This is pathetic!
SimonStylites 22 May 2014 11:16pm
This coup will never receive comments on its real purpose because the laws of Thailand do not permit this.
I am assuming the Guardian operates under other laws.
The King of Thailand is very old - he may even be dead (this is just speculation).
What is fact is that he will die very soon. It is feared the new monarch will not have the "God-like" support this monarch and his predecessors have had.
There are many reasons for this. Modern times and modern communications are factors. Knowledge of various interpretations of democracy that have developed in and around Thailand will play a part.
The polarisation of the last 8 years require a solid and stabile Thai royal family. Without this fundament in Thai life, civil war is a strong possibility.
The Kings successor has not shown he has the personality to fill his father's shoes.
WAJohn SimonStylites 23 May 2014 12:00am
Agree 100% , Once The KIng dies, Thailand will decend into chaos, there will be a period of mass national grief followed by a long period of violent power struggle.
The heir apparaent is detested by the Thai people, if he forces himself onto the throne, the monarchy will fall, his sister the Princess is popular, but unless the Prince gives way to her, the transistion will not be peacefull.
23 May 2014 12:13am
No it won't. Difficult times are ahead and there may be a need for the military's hand to maintain stability in the short term, but reforms that address current concerns and that will move the country forward are both possible and inevitable. Change has to come, and it will, but just for now the opposing groups need to be held apart, and the vitriolic, rabble-rousing TV stations made to state their points of view in a more reasonable way. Some have been guilty of virtually inciting armed rebellion! My view is not a fascist one, although no doubt I will be accused of same, It is just realistic. Democracy is young, and partial and has recently boiled over. No one can put the toothpaste back in the tube. Change is coming, but the pace has to be regulated or chaos will result, and into the vacuum that follows chaos steps evil. There is a huge sector of the population, I believe a majority, that just wants things to settle down for now while calmer heads prevail.
HenrySwanson
23 May 2014 3:25am
It won't fly in Australia or USA, these countries crack down on protesters fast and hard before the movement gets any momentum.
See how fast the Occupy movement was arrested / beaten / pepper sprayed, and those were mostly unarmed hippies.
robertinjapan The_Truth_Hurts
23 May 2014 1:20am
In response to The truth hurts: "they are not ready for democracy."
What,so Vietnam is ready then? How about Cambodia then? While we are at it then, how bout Laos?
You've got some bollocks mate,proclaiming "they are not ready for democracy"
Or rather you "DONT" have what some might consider the prerequisite number of testicles on an average educated individuals ball counting abacus.
23 May 2014 1:11am
When the elite not affiliated with Thaksin were in power, corruption was rampant as well. This is nothing but a power grab by the elites that can no longer get to power by elections. The only way the so called "reform" would work is by silencing the majority of the population so a faction of the elite can stay in power for as long as they want. The only looser will always be the majority of the poor people in Thailand.
History teaches us that the only goal for each and every military coup is to increase their power, increase their personal wealth and destroy all opposition.
And that they call progress.
Politicians have learned to mislead an ignorant public with populist rantings that do little to improve their conditions. In Thailand, the difference seems to be that the elite has not yet figured out how to rule effectively by manipulating democracy, as the elites have figured out in the our Council and European elections. The elite in Thailand is divided. One part is actively resisting democracy, claiming that the rural people are easily misled and want to support governments that are bad
Jacob Garbo robertinjapan
23 May 2014 2:40am
Close but no cigar. The "ammart" ie Old Money (usually old families, landowners) still display a feudal mindset, which is being eroded by increasing knowledge among the "phrai" ie serfs. The younger "phrai" have realized that they aren't condemned (by an inherited Indian caste system) to remain poor farmers following their parents. Industrialization has caused/offered the opportunity to break out. Of course the ammart control industry, too. The dilemma as the song goes: "How do you keep 'em down on the farm after they've seen Paree?" So we have an 800 year old elite confronting a 50 year old (two generations) industrialization and social change.
Thaksin exploited the "democratic" loophole - one man=one vote - and went where the most folks lived, offered them dreams, grabbed their votes - and power - then screwed them over. But they're waking up, and faster than the elite. They can now demand a better deal from the next bunch of carpetbaggers.
Thaksin and the Red Shirt bosses hatched from the same crocodile egg and they'll eat everything they see, even their young.
sighjay Jacob Garbo
23 May 2014 3:47am
So you support an election? If he 'screwed them over' and they are now waking up as you claim, it should be a walk in for the Democrats, right? Especially if, as evidence collected by academics suggests, the last election was reasonably clean.
It's hard to see why Suthep and his mob have battled so hard to prevent a vote if it is as you say.gluon1
23 May 2014 1:52am
"They've never had a coup like this, in which this potential of mass resistance is so strong,"
I too fear that this may be a different kind of coup. Unless (and I hope this is the case) the military tread very gently, and genuinely try to respect the will of the majority of the Thai people. General Prayuth has said in the past that the army is for all the Thai people, let's hope he lives up to his words. The signs are ominous though and I feel he may be out of his depth in the role he has assumed for himself.
All of this is really about who is in control during the succession of the monarchy. General Prayuth may well be under instructions to ensure that it is him or someone of his choosing. It's all somewhat Machiavellian.
jimkrimson
23 May 2014 1:54am
they decided at 9 o'clock last night that all the schools across thailand are to closed from friday to sunday.
so that means my son and i will watch the lego movie, maybe that's what all these numpties in bangkok should be doing.
the reds, the yellows , the elite the whoever are like anyone else they are going after what benefits themselves the most. and none of these groups can accept the other team winning after the coup it will go back to where it was before. the poor shall remain poor -borrowing money of whoever they can, the up and coming middle class can buy the latest Iphone and the rich can buy a new mercedes send their kids off to foreign countries for their education .
and in 2020 we can have another coup when the next wrong government gets in.
jetassistedostrich 23 May 2014 2:00am
I'd be interested to know why so many strings of comments have been truncated or removed by moderators today -- not deleted, just disappeared. Has censorship spread out from Bangkok, or is this just some software glitch following the new page Previous 1,2,3,4 Next format. Here's hoping it's the latter eh!
Oldgitom 23 May 2014 2:06am
I see Thailand's crisis as a rehearsal in micrososm for the far grander ending of democracy in the USA.
The Bush-Obama dirty duo have left the US Constituion in ribbons. Habeas Corpus is no more. As with 800 years back, the King/President can kill & imprison at will. S/he 'can do no wrong'. The 'justice system' is little more than the state prosecution service, where only money guarantees a fair trial. More prisoners banged up than in any other country, & the miltarized police & 'peace officers' have two billioh rounds of anti-personnel rounds in reserve. FEMA concentration camps are built & ready to receive thousands of inmates.
All the apparatus of a police state is ready in the USA. It is only one false-flag away from declaration of martial law. And if democracy falls there, it falls everywhere.
Jacob Garbo Oldgitom 23 May 2014 3:13am
You've been away, it seems. US democracy died long ago. Martial law was instituted long ago. No more habeas corpus, phone call, access to legal representation. See:
https://www.aclu.org/blog/tag/ndaa
jetassistedostrich Jacob Garbo 23 May 2014 3:18am
You are making some good posts today! See also:
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/princeton-experts-say-us-no-longer-democracy
artdealer Oldgitom
23 May 2014 4:55am
How is it Obama's fault that the first and fourth (so far) amendments are shredded. As one media commentator recently remarked, Obama looks more and more like a deer caught in the headlights. The reality is that the NSA et al, are the ones responsible for the slow shredding of the American constitution. But you're correct about a police state, it's getting as bad or even worse than an in your face communist country, and the fear and propaganda spread daily is sometimes beyond belief to me.
Oldgitom artdealer 23 May 2014 12:33pm
artdealer,
well, we know Obama is a sock-puppet, but he's the sock-puppet in nominal charge, so he bears the blame. The NSA is just one of many instruments of state oppression he could bring to heel if he had the heart & soul, brains & b*lls.
And no, the USA is not threatened by 'communism'. That's old Cold War, right-wing BS. It has been suborned by Wall St bankers & oligarchs - good ole-fashioned, Yankee doodle capitalism, gone senile & rotten.
coeurnoir NY1985
23 May 2014 3:00am
One word from him the general would go back to his hole. That's basically how powerful he is, even if he's supposedly only a constitutional monarch. His heir is however, universally hated. Sadly, the king is probably no longer coherent/cognisant.NY1985 coeurnoir
23 May 2014 3:08am
How unfortunate.....like the Japanese Emperor's of old he is believed to be a living God, yet this heavenly Lion has the roar of a Mouse.
coeurnoir NY1985 23 May 2014 3:16am
It might be a blessing in disguise. It's time they abolished lese-majeste and dilute the power base away from the Old Establishment - give the proletariat classes a chance to haul themselves out of poverty, as it were.
theunknowing 23 May 2014 2:37am
Serious analysis follows:
As far as I'm aware, Thai politics is like a rigged closed football league. In it are four teams. The Kings XI, The Generals XI, The Swivel-Eyed Loony Elite XI, and The Village Poor XI.
Nearly all the fans in the league support the Village Poor XI, they play in red, though everyone's second favourite team in almost all circumstances is The Kings XI, who run out in a bad-70's-makeover luxuriant gold. A small minority of prawn sandwich eaters follow their local side the Loony Elite, decked out in pale yellow and red, blue and white wristbands They also have a soft spot for close neighbours, The Generals, who do nothing for seasons and then suddenly rise up and win everything.
Such is the popularity of the Village poor XI, that the three other teams almost only ever transfer key players between themselves. So naturally, there's a lot of communication and cooperation between the Kings, Generals and Elite.
23 May 2014 7:51am
Very amusing analogy.
But you forgot to mention that the sponsor of the Village Poor XI was previously a coach for the other teams who decided he wasn't making enough billions. So he bought some key players from the other teams to set up his Village Poor XI and decided that his team would combine football with handball, rugby and snooker.
When the other teams called 'Foul' the referee was threatened with grenade attacks and warned that any free-kicks awarded to other teams would be unfair and biased. The Village Poor XI's striker made several own goals and was finally sent off, but the Village Poor XI insisted on continuing the game insisting that they were the only team playing real football.
rogiman1 fleeing
23 May 2014 8:33am
absolutely important addition to the story.
Add more-
some Village Poor were getting so angry with their own bosses for not being paid what they were promised,they were actually,for the first time ,intersted in a transfer to the Loony Elite.However ,those really deserve to be called 'Loony' for they prevented those transfers when they wrecked the Transefer Window on Feb 2.and so lost the chance to have some Villagers -which would have been the first time ever and just might have opened up the League
jhb fleeing
23 May 2014 9:47am
You forgot the part about the sponsor and several key strikers of the Village Poor XI all being shown first red cards for foul play and then being given a ten match suspension by the Thai Sweet F.A. officials for match fixing. There were also several allegations of bribing officials, removing goal posts and corner flags, as well as paying supporters to attend matches, rather than the norm in other countries of fans paying to see a match. The Village Poor XI held a team meeting in Dubai and decided that they would request a lifting of the suspension and scratch all trace of previous misdeeds from their record, which frankly didn't go down well with any of the other teams, including a fair number of Village Poor fans.
As a result, it was decided by the Generals and Kings XI that enough was enough and the league was no longer operable while one of the teams spent more time discussing new underhand tactics to knobble the refs from Dubai. Now, upset fans from all sides will have to switch sports, while a new formula for the league is worked out.
fflambeau
23 May 2014 2:40am
Suthep (the leader of the Monarchists except for the big guy himself, who is behind all of this) was taken from the meeting so he could get a medal. Suthep, the military, and the monarchist appointed judges effectively removed a democratically elected government by a coup that was coordinated with all 3 groups taking roles. John Kerry got it right: this coup was absolutely unnecessary; Suthep is the guy who gave the order 3 or 4 years ago leading to the direct killing of almost 200 people; very few people were injured or hurt in the past months of mostly peaceful protests. Now the USA and EU must back up their words and withhold money and support from this illegal takeover.
artdealer fflambeau
23 May 2014 5:06am
The rich Thais have been investing everywhere including at least one casino in LAs Vegas as far as I am aware. They are also heavily invested in all other Asian countries including China. They are not stupid and know where to deposit their sometimes ill gotten gains, including extensively the London property market. A couple of years ago one Thai woman actually approached me to see if I was interested in buying her (choke ) 11 million pound London apartment, which was just a sly way of letting me know she was a whore made good.
AndyCanfield
23 May 2014 2:43am
RIght-wing coup, left-wing election, one more time around the cycle.
Coup is no problem; Curfew is a problem. No midnight 7/11, no overnight busses to or from Bangkok, schools closed through Sunday. Curfew is a nuisance.
No panic here; we've seen it all before.
(I am wearing a red shirt.)
HauptmannGurski
23 May 2014 2:46am
Kerry's anger is understandable, because it is not likely that in this interim situation they can impose the Trans-Pacific Partnership on Thailand. My hope is, that this makes the whole construction unravel or lead to a better construction.
What matters is 1. you can walk down the street safely, without ending up in a riot with burning tyres or a gang of robbers. 2. The electronic manufacturers (Western Digital?) are working as normal. 3. People have food and clean water wherever their rooves over their heads are.
From what I read on the net, there may well be a democracy deficiency in Kerry's homeland and maybe he should apply his considerable talents there.
HauptmannGurski Will D 23 May 2014 5:20am
But you have to give it to him that he has been able to undertake a learning process: Unlike before he is no longer raising his index finger when he talks to the press corps. It was in the job description apparently because Hillary did that, too. You can only ever learn one new trick at one time. Maybe he'll learn further as time goes on.
vivivivi 23 May 2014 2:56am
There are behind-the-scenes shenanigans that none of us are party to and they relate to a far more complicated dilemma over Royal succession. This is why the army have made this pre-emptive move before it gets any messier. Clearly the acting govt has lost all control and respect and that's because they were, for the past 2 years, a reckless proxy for Thaksin - a fugitive criminal no different from Marcos or Mugabe. He is anything but democratic and doesn't have more than 45% of the support, so it's incorrect to say that the 'people's choice' was removed. Undemocratic as this coup might seem it's a radical resistance to one man's quest to usurp Thailand's next King. For many Thaksin is completely unacceptable, and he just won't exit gracefully.
Quicknstraight theunknowing 23 May 2014 4:53am
Ah, criticism of Thaksin makes one a fascist?
There is plenty of evidence of Thaksin's corruption. And installing his sister in his stead was a crass attempt to hold on to power.
Even large chunks of their voter base, in the north of Thailand, are fed up with the Puea Thai government after the rice scandal.
robertinjapan
23 May 2014 3:13am
One variation of the current situation in Thailand being played out as follows:
The situation will invariably deteriorate to the situation where the military will call upon the king to intervene to help bring about a once again,peace to the crisis. The situation as being relied upon so many times previously ,will inevitably broaden the discussion and will invoke his actual constitutional position in law to the forefront of the current crisis more so than previous occasions. Most probably he will call upon the Americans to intervene in an agreed negioated settlement, similar to the situation that arose when Mountbatten demanded immediate democratic elections after WWII. The Americans will intervene,where by the Russians and Chinese will sound off international sound bites about American and British hypocrisy,when it comes to International law, and thus usher in a 21st Century version of Détente.Who said there's no such thing as time machines? Back to the future.Some are still as quick as a Fox in a flock of silver geese.
nyclsr
23 May 2014 3:19am
I rather think democracy as a system and a desired goal is on the wane, maybe even has come to an end. Not just in Thailand where a military dictatorship is their only possible and best system. For there is no use holding elections if the results are thrown by the wayside if they are not to your liking.
But also, democracy is exists in name only in the US where few people vote, business funds the elections, and corporate media decides which candidates get to air their views. There is no such veneer in China: simple one party rule is what works for them and there is no need to make apologies or nod to the past. An authoritarian figure has assumed power in India. In the UK, the press is being muzzled.
Oligarchy is the system that emerging for the 21st century. Just give enough to the 99% to make sure there are no big riots.
Democracy is dead.
Quicknstraight nyclsr
23 May 2014 4:49am
Indeed. As I commented below, once politics becomes a career choice, democracy is dead.
Democracy only works when the politicians act in the best interests of the people. Name me one democratic country where that is the case.
People in the US and Europe love to champion democracy but, if truth be told, democracy isn't working in their own back yards. Yes, they have a vote. Yes, they have different parties to chose from. Bug do they improve the life of the people? Really? No, in my opinion.
I think the US and Europe need to stop confusing the right to vote with what true democracy is.
artdealer Quicknstraight
23 May 2014 5:20am
Exactly, it's becoming a bit of a cliché, this democracy lie thing, which as someone once said is "a good idea in theory" but as we see in realty is nothing but a cover for corporate institutions and the military industrial complex in all western countries to take over our lives which is what I'm seeing in the USA and is indeed a sad sight to see when I look into the eyes of my very good American friends who are slowly waking up to the reality of their own 1984 nightmare.
WAJohn nyclsr
23 May 2014 5:56am
China might as well return to the Emperor and Russia the Tsar, they are ruled in the same way, and it works for them as it has done for 1000's of year, sometimes things just work better when left alone.
Thailand ( Siam) was probably on the averages over 1000's of years more stable under Absolute Monarchy before it was abolised in 1932.
Other faild experiements in modern democarcy litter the world, you can even inlcude Greece which is somewhat ironic. The foreign imposed constitutional monarcy was an abject failure, leading to a Junta, a series of failed Governments.
ID7298495
23 May 2014 3:27am
I hope that conscientious tourists, including backpackers, show their disapproval by not coming to Thailand. The northern areas, by the way, were and remain completely unaffected by the coup, indeed, by political and military machinations in the capital.
AnthonyParra ID7298495
23 May 2014 4:08am
Yeap good idea let's put over 4 Million people who work in the tourism industry and have nothing to do with the politics out of work.
Will D ID7298495
23 May 2014 4:30am
Stupid suggestion that would just punish the ordinary people of Thailand.
No. That would only penalise the poorest people who depend on tourism to survive.
robertinjapan
23 May 2014 3:35am
I'm not sure this latest coup will resolve the Thaksin divide. What did the last coup, in September 2006, achieve? There are fundamental social and economic forces at play within the country. The north's affection for Thaksin's policies, and their demands that they be represented through government policies - admittedly very costly and in some respects misguided - won't be swept away simply because the army is in control.
Thailand has Southeast Asia's strongest economy; it receives millions of tourists each year; ideally, it would stand as a bulwark of democratic stability amidst neighbours that are communist and/or authoritarian. Today's actions represent yet another sad chapter in Thailand's long and debilitating struggle to achieve greater economic equality and political representation. So far, that effort is failing.
It is a curious thing, but I have been right in everything I have done and said in my life._Mountbatten
He was spot on about (Siam) Thailand all those years ago.
charlesbentley
23 May 2014 4:00am
Contrary to propaganda from foreign news agencies and no it all keyboard warriors, it was not a violent coup at all. The military had no choice if they wished to prevent conflict. The Thai army is normally in the job of preventing war rather causing it, unlike certain nations around the world. How do i know.....i live, work and pay taxes in Thailand. So much of what you read is rubbish. Either manipulated news, misinformed or just plain wrong. Having lived in Thailand for twenty years and Uk.......please give me Thailand any day of the week.
Felix Qui charlesbentley
23 May 2014 7:51am
If you live in Thailand and lawfully refrain from seeking information from outside Thailand on what is strictly censored within Thailand, then you cannot possibly have a sound grasp of what is going on in Thailand.
Anyone school kid or granny net browser in the US or wherever can have a better informed grasp of Thai politics and society than all lawful opinion within Thailand - this is an immediate and logically certain consequence of censorship that violates free speech on a topic.
Quicknstraight BIKERBRI
23 May 2014 4:36am
Democracy is overrated. The best way to run a country is a benevolent dictatorship, rather like Singapore and, to some extent, colonial Hong Kong.
As Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs illustrated, people's prime concern is a roof over their heads, ability to earn a living and feed themselves. Having a vote comes way down the list of needs.
It is hard to argue that democracy has worked in many places, isn't it? Democracy only works when the politicians are in it for the public good, which very often they are not.
Once you get an entrenched party system, such as in the UK or US, for example, democracy is polluted by the parties' desire to hold onto power and influence. The good of the people is chucked out of the window.
When politics becomes a career choice, democracy becomes a joke. And the funny thing is, places where democracy is a joke, like the UK, are those that bleat loudest about how important democracy is!
Perhaps those in the UK and US ( and I am British citizen, born and bred, BTW), who bleat about democracy, can tell us the last government they elected that truly acted in the best interest of the population as a whole? I think you'll have to go back in time rather a long way, eh?
DjangoReinhart Quicknstraight
23 May 2014 5:16am
You are incredibly naive about democracy and what it brings to people.
Countries without democracy have no reason to consider the needs and wants to the people. People have no influence over the government and can just be suppressed.
Do you think it is just a coincidence that universal healthcare, free education, a minimum wage, health and safety legislation etc were invented by democratic countries?
If you grew up in a democracy and enjoyed the benefits you are a scoundrel for advocating the imposition of dictatoship on Thailand - you want to deprive the Thai people of the benefits of democracy while you yourself would probably be a poor ill-educated dirt-farmer yourself if it had not been because you had had the good luck to be born in a democracy.
Felix Qui Quicknstraight
23 May 2014 7:47am
Benevolent dictatorship is the best way to run a country for whom? Certainly not the citizens, who are ever subject to arbitrary arrest, to interrogation of their personal affairs, to restriction on what they chew, smoke and eat, on a capricious basis. And always the danger that the benevolence will turn malevolent.
And since censorship precludes the possibility of informed opinion of worth for all lawful opinion, it cannot even be known whether any self-styled "benevolent" dictatorship is in fact benevolent. Free speech is a necessary condition for knowledge and informed opinion on any topic.
Beforethingschanged Quicknstraight
23 May 2014 8:12am
You mention Maslow's hierarchy: democracy is not part of the hierarchy you probably mean self-actualisation, of which the primary aspects, those involved in physical survival are enabling conditions; democracy is a necessary condition for the higher aspects of his hierarchy.
Much of what you say about the condition of "democracy" is right but that means reform not cynical acceptance.
Quicknstraight DjangoReinhart
23 May 2014 8:31am
No, I am realistic. We live in the real world, not some fantasy land. In the majority of democracies, the benefits you allude to are not provided for the citizens, particularly in Asia and the Sub-Continent.
The UK, which provides the benefits you allude to, is slowly bleeding to death as a result of the financial burden it imposes on the tax payer.
Oldpedant Quicknstraight
23 May 2014 9:39am
Thailand introduced universal healthcare in 2001/02. It is not perfect, but people have a much better chance of decent care than before. That is beginning to show in the statistics.
http://www.gurn.info/en/topics/health-politics-and-trade-unions/development-and-health-determinants/development-and-health-determinants/thailand2019s-universal-coverage-scheme-achievements-and-challenges
http://www.smartplanet.com/blog/bulletin/in-thailand-a-13-percent-drop-in-infant-mortality-in-a-year/
I continue to be amazed that expats who have lived in the Kingdom for years have no understanding of the Thai health care system and recent health care polices.
Quicknstraight
23 May 2014 4:25am
Lots of experts bleating about human rights and all that, but what they're saying in not reflective of the events on the ground here in Bangkok.
Yes, there's a curfew and the media are off the air. But the Thais I have spoken to since the coup was declared yesterday evening are not too bothered about it. Many think it will make life safer for them.
All this talk of violence by the military is bollocks here in Bangkok. The only violence we've had was down to the UDD's Red Shirt thugs, with the PAD and their coalition's Yellow Shirts threatening to wage war on the streets of Bangkok. Something had to be done.
The various political groups were given a chance to settle their differences and refused to do so, despite the army threatening the coup. This morning, life here in Bangkok is going on as normal, apart from schools being closed for three days.
It's not like everybody is cowering in their homes, for goodness sakes. The media should start reporting accurately on these events and the fallout so far, not spouting crap to ramp up ratings.
Quicknstraight Nick Kenchington
23 May 2014 4:40am
Oh, you mean you have to go home a big earlier? Wow, what crushing oppressive imposition on you, eh?
I should have thought you'd be happier about the army heading off the violence between factions that was going to kick off over the next couple of weeks.
But then why let the safety of the general population in Bangkok get in the way of your life, eh? We live here in Bangkok and the curfew makes little practical difference to daily life. We might have to go out for dinner or the cinema a bit earlier. Boo hoo.
Quicknstraight wombat123
23 May 2014 8:27pm
Oh, I certainly do have a clue. Civil war, now the army is in control is unlikely.
What is more likely is that leaders of the Reds will be removed from the board, as they say, if you know what I mean. The Red leadership will be removed at the first hint of trouble.
I imagine the vast majority of their supporters will disband and go home once they realise the army isn't messing about at the first hint of trouble.
As fir my reference to the cinema, I was merely demonstrating that most people are carrying on living their lives with almost total normalcy.
What should we do? Make tin foil hats and hide under the bed?
If the situation worsens, the we will take appropriate action. We are not idiots here, you know. Until such time, there is no point in getting all worked up about it.I served in the army and police and am not going to start panicking now.
wombat123 Quicknstraight
23 May 2014 10:42pm
If the junta uses the draconian methods you suggest you can kiss Thailand's tourist industry goodbye. Other companies will keep away if the army brings in a reign of terror against all democratic leaders. There aren't many tourists going to Egypt at the moment. A ruthless crackdown by the army could produce a loss of tourism and still fail to prevent civil war.
Quicknstraight wombat123 24 May 2014 7:16am
Perversely, such action would probably increase tourism in the medium term, with potential tourists perceiving it as an improvement in public safety.
And I didn't say it would be action against ALL protest leaders, just those who pose a threat to the public by inciting, or leading, violent action.
BIKERBRI 23 May 2014 4:34am
The economic divide between the north and south of Thailand is the main cause of the problems in Thailand. The powerful elite's, royalist, and Bangkok middle classes see themselves as the tax payers, supporting the northern masses, who pay little or no tax, and because of this they are looked down upon by their own people and called buffaloes. It is misconception to believe that Thai's love Thai's. In fact BangkokThai's hate the people in the North and only see then good for wiping their backsides and providing cheap labour to build their luxury shopping malls.The generals coup, and is reasoning for it, will not change the circumstances until some one comes up with an answer to the inequality and the poor distribution of wealth.
artdealer BIKERBRI 23 May 2014 5:40am
You all who know so much and not a word when it comes to a different wealth distribution in the north- south Thai divide. Take Phuket and Koh Sumui for example. Not much democracy ever in those cursed islands, that the deputy head of the DSI (Thai FBI.) once told me had been lost to Thailand because of the mafia strongholds that they are.
For personal reasons, I am interested to see how the arrival of the Russians in Phuket in particular will pan out eventually. Up till now the Thai mafia in those islands have been able to see off all comers who tried to get successful business's up and running and usually eventually failed, but the Russians (with their own mafia) are a different kettle of fish as the Thais are finding out.
Quicknstraight MikePilgrim 23 May 2014 5:03am
I asked for real, actual, working links to some, any, EVIDENCE.
All you are doing is chucking out a couple of names, which anybody can do.
What we want to see is EVIDENCE. If you can't provide said links, then stop dissent instinct baseless rumours.
Quicknstraight MikePilgrim 23 May 2014 5:42am
Equally, if it looks like BS, sounds like BS, it is BS.
I'm say pure the CIA would everyone to think they're involved, even when they capability to stick their noses in died out a while ago. They do not have the resources to fund the type of operations you allude to anymore.
artdealer MikePilgrim
23 May 2014 5:52am
The CIA will have had some influence probably, but not in using Thailand against China, that's impossible, what can Thailand do to in such a scenario, especially as the ethic Thai Chinese are the staple of the Thai business community. The Chinese in whichever country they reside never turn against the motherland, unless maybe they are from Taiwan and even then it is moot.
Conversely, and in passing, Taksin Shinawatra and his former PM. sister are both ethnic Chinese and is yet another unspoken factor in his and her deposed state, a point that you all who think they know everything about Thailand forgot to factor in.
MikePilgrim artdealer 24 May 2014 5:46am
Shinawatra (Chinese proxy) vs. Royal Thai Armed Forces RTGS (US proxy) Thai Air Force bases are part of Pentagon's "forward positioning" strategy. The Thai got the US to leave in 1976 and the US came back in 1998 (part of the US-Chinese) struggle in Thailand. Lets see if the RTGS can do Langleys bidding and keep the Shinwatras out of power to increase Pentagon's presence (keeping China under the US gun at close range)
ID1833104 MikePilgrim 24 May 2014 10:39am
Prostitution is illegal in Thailand...just like many other countries....and of course in those other countries there is no one participating in paedophile activities is there?...bit of a lazy stereotype about Thailand the vast majority of which is free of this curse. Unnless Mike you only visit places such as the cesspit of Pattaya?. Admittedly cheap sex is available here for those who wish to purchase but then again the Yanks introduced the brothels to Pattaya during the American war in Vietnam. Sad to me so many Thais prepared to sell themselves but then again if fat western farangs did not want to buy there would be no cattle market would there?
useronthenet 23 May 2014 4:48am
This is the 'ugly' face of Thailand that most don't see.
The reds said their would be repercussions if there was a coup, so it's difficult to determine what will happen next. The Army planned this all along, since the execution of such a coup was swift, and well organized, and its fair to say therefore the Army lied to it's own people. All because the elite who control the country are desperate to hold onto power.
Most of the country is on lock-down, including Radio,TV, travel, that there are rumors there will be a restriction of the internet, one wonders if it will get worse ?
I feel sorry for the tourists, who perhaps saved all year, but no have had their holidays ruined.
Seems at the moment Thailand still isn't ready to join the ranks of the rest of the world, where most really do enjoy true democracy!
AlexRussia 23 May 2014 5:00am
RBC 05.22.2014, Washington 22:12:45 U.S. stop military cooperation with Thailand, since U.S. law prohibits military cooperation with countries where there was a coup - a position designated Secretary of State, John Kerry, reports BBC BBC. In addition, Kerry stressed that the coup in Thailand " has no excuse." He also expressed concern about reports of detention of political leaders in Thailand and called for their release.
jonhimself 23 May 2014 5:12am
So many uninformed comments being made in here. There is only a couple that are making any sense. Let's face it, as soon as the army declared martial law all of us living here knew that was just a poorly hidden synonym for coup.
This general was involved in the last coup stripping Thaksin of power and we can all make the safe assumption that the next person who makes it in will be in someway linked to the anti-government protestors or linked to the royals just like last time. Since then the divide widened. What can he expect to achieve this time except some extra power for himself seeing as he has named himself PM now?
This is a very Thai way of thinking - what can I get now? rather than looking at the future repercussions.
The unfortunate thing is people on both sides forget that both sides are just as corrupt, murderous and prone to as many other illegal activities as each other.
No, democracy may not be perfect, but at least the idea of one person one vote is better than having some self elected elite council tell the rest of the country that their vote counts for nothing.
This coup is not solving any problems - just creating new ones.
MikePilgrim jonhimself
23 May 2014 5:18am
Keep harassing the Chinese, Kerry, and they will show you the way to the curb, as you are finding out. Getting the US trained and equipped Thai military to stop the protests, when counter demonstrations did not work, to give you time to find another pliable puppet, won't work.
billythefish8 jonhimself
23 May 2014 6:43am
Jonhimself. What you say is probably quite true and in order.
I do however feel that there are other issues. Last week, a customer of mine, a very high ranking executive in a Japanese car company, informed me that his company had recently, and very reluctantly, moved 20% of their car manufacturing production from Thailand to Indonesia. Also they were seriously considering leaving the country altogether. This would involve the loss of hundreds of thousands of jobs, if you include all the industry suppliers. He also pointed out that the other major motor manufacturers were monitoring the political situation very closely and had put all planned future investment on hold. The manufacturing regions of Thailand have thousands of foreign owned companies. If they in turn start to withdraw from Thailand, we are heading back towards the third world.
Whilst Democracy is the worst form of Government after all the others, I feel that there comes a time when it needs to be suspended, especially when two parties are as entrenched as the two Thai parties. There really is not one inch of compromise from either party; the Farangs, sitting on the fence, can see nothing but civil war approaching. Idiots like John Kerry, are so entrenched in the view that nothing but Democracy will do, do not take into account the difference in cultures between the two societies.
We all want Democracy returned as soon as possible, but in the meantime, what we need is stability.
PongoTwistleton 23 May 2014 5:35am
I can't believe the sanctimonious crap re corruption in Thailand posted here. The Thais are mere beginners compared to Cameron and his cronies who give billions in "contracts" to their mates, steal state assets and flog them off at knockdown prices to their paymasters, ( a few million to the Chancellor's best man), dinners for access, the "free" schools scam, the list could go on and on. Of course all this is done through the their mates in the City, hedge funds or off shore with a percentage eventually going to finance the Tory party. No doubt about it, the UK is whiter than white.
broadreach15
23 May 2014 5:52am
Seems Thailand might be getting under control now? But it looks like there is a Gag Order on Ukraine in place, also for Guardian.(( It is becoming evident that the Interim regime in Kiev is actually a Terrorist government. All events not favorable to them like the Odessa fire murder, the around 100 people murdered in Kiev's Maidan Square to facilitate installation of US/EU puppet government are left without proper investigations. And even OSCE is biased and censored to suit Interim government. Journalists having different opinions than Kiev Western appointed top leaders are terrorized , jailed having to flee for family safety etc.. Western governments records on complete support of this evidently Terrorist regime will be remembered. European leaders you have bloody hands in Ukraine also..
